Tulpa.info - tulpa-discussion

Its not about knowledge, its about bias. (edited)

4

>read a discussion from 8 days ago >see the link someone posted in the discussion >copy and paste it again with same argumentation, people don't remember it was posted anyway

Never too late point out the obvious facts

Desting 😎 (Con Cat)-(おひたし、お浸し)

The worst person to diagnose you is yourself: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Medical_students%27_disease

if you understand that wiki page then you'll be fine this is my experience (edited)

Understanding a possibility of being biased doesn't tell you how exactly biased you are in a given case. And your anecdotal experience doesn't prove that someone else won't misdiagnose themselves due to bias. Are you seriously not understanding the problem or just trolling, @sh?

Fran

Understanding a possibility of being biased doesn't tell you how exactly biased you are in a given case. And your anecdotal experience doesn't prove that someone else won't misdiagnose themselves due to bias. Are you seriously not understanding the problem or just trolling, @sh?

and you can't imagine that someone could possibly have different experiences in life to you, therefore they must be trolling it's simple: in practice, self-dxing is, or at the very least can be, perfectly fine, or even better than going to some person who ask the same questions you could ask yourself

It's not about lack of possibility of succeeding due to self-diagnosis but increased possibility of making a mistake due to self-diagnosis.

what if the medical professional makes a mistake

If your self-diagnosis is different from professional diagnosis, you can consult another professional. Doing self-diagnosis is not a problem, depending on it without verification is. No one said that professionals don't make mistakes. If you think you have enough knowledge to diagnose yourself, you should at least check out opinion of (another) professional and consider it. Doctors should do it too when diagnosing themselves.

I'm not really part of this conversation but I'd assume the rate at which medical professionals make mistakes I'd far lower than anyone who, isn't infact, a medical professional like if we're talking about the statistics of that...

Fran

If your self-diagnosis is different from professional diagnosis, you can consult another professional. Doing self-diagnosis is not a problem, depending on it without verification is. No one said that professionals don't make mistakes. If you think you have enough knowledge to diagnose yourself, you should at least check out opinion of (another) professional and consider it. Doctors should do it too when diagnosing themselves.

that's a good answer yeah

Fran

If your self-diagnosis is different from professional diagnosis, you can consult another professional. Doing self-diagnosis is not a problem, depending on it without verification is. No one said that professionals don't make mistakes. If you think you have enough knowledge to diagnose yourself, you should at least check out opinion of (another) professional and consider it. Doctors should do it too when diagnosing themselves.

diagnosis accuracy is all about knowing as much as possible. do you really think a doctor can know more about you than you do

er

it's also about bias though isn't it?

5:14 PM

I mean

5:14 PM

when I try and get a description of myself I usually ask other people

5:14 PM

primarily because I know little about myself; but I'm also biased by my internal thoughts

how on earth do you know less about urself than ur friend

well I'd agree that that's true about me, but that's not what I meant

5:16 PM

hold on I've got to do something but I'll try and explain what I mean in a bit

i don't even think that's possible? unless you block it out of your mind

5:17 PM

ok

Fran

If your self-diagnosis is different from professional diagnosis, you can consult another professional. Doing self-diagnosis is not a problem, depending on it without verification is. No one said that professionals don't make mistakes. If you think you have enough knowledge to diagnose yourself, you should at least check out opinion of (another) professional and consider it. Doctors should do it too when diagnosing themselves.

you don't depend on self dx for anything because it isn't official ir recognised so i don't get what you mean

diagnosis accuracy is all about knowing as much as possible. do you really think a doctor can know more about you than you do

@sh - jump People's observations can give you some insight about yourself that you could overlook though. And as I said, feel free to self-diagnose, just visit a doctor too and confront your diagnosis with yours, maybe they noticed something you didn't or pointed out a direction you haven't considered before.

it's like 'oh i meet all the diagnostic criteria for DID, that means i'll consider myself as a DID system

you don't depend on self dx for anything because it isn't official ir recognised so i don't get what you mean

@sh - jump I'm sorry, I don't understand what you are talking about right now either

Fran

you don't depend on self dx for anything because it isn't official ir recognised so i don't get what you mean

@sh - jump I'm sorry, I don't understand what you are talking about right now either

Fran

diagnosis accuracy is all about knowing as much as possible. do you really think a doctor can know more about you than you do

@sh - jump People's observations can give you some insight about yourself that you could overlook though. And as I said, feel free to self-diagnose, just visit a doctor too and confront your diagnosis with yours, maybe they noticed something you didn't or pointed out a direction you haven't considered before.

if you have DID you'll be thinking about it a lot for a while, it'd be difficult to miss anything

5:22 PM

if you didn't consider all the options in the first place maybe you had terrible knowledge

5:22 PM

reminds me of tulpa guides actually

5:22 PM

when something goes wrong it's often bad or incorrect knowledge to blame

if you have DID you'll be thinking about it a lot for a while, it'd be difficult to miss anything

@sh - jump If your case have been obvious, it doesn't mean cases of other people are. And people usually are not aware of knowledge they lack.

well they can be aware of what they lack by doing research

5:27 PM

which like most did systems do on did

Yeah, they can. Still, they should consult their self-diagnosis with a doctor. Why are you opposed to the idea of verifying your self-diagnosis with a professional?

i'm opposed to being binarily opposed to selfdxing

5:33 PM

i hate binaries if you didn't notice

sh

i don't even think that's possible? unless you block it out of your mind

what I meant is that a person can be biased towards certain results, without acknowledgement of that, hell knows I've done that; getting an opinion from someone else is key in that sort of scenario.

5:39 PM

as for not really knowing myself, I just know very little about what I want to do and lack motivation to really pursue any given interest I have usually. I also don't really analyze how I "talk" to other people so at any given time I'm not exactly aware of what disposition I give people usually...

Deleted User

what I meant is that a person can be biased towards certain results, without acknowledgement of that, hell knows I've done that; getting an opinion from someone else is key in that sort of scenario.

what if that person is even more biased than you are?

the best person to diagnose you... is yourself*

@sh - jump Btw. you have given a person who clearly didn't have knowledge, an advice to self-diagnose. It could be harmful.

sh

what if that person is even more biased than you are?

that uh, yeah that can be a concern depending on who the doctor is

5:40 PM

the best idea would be to find a place with great reviews regarding cases similar to your own suspicions I assume

5:44 PM

yeah I don't have anything else to really sat about that

5:46 PM

self-dxing I think is good for telling whether it may be likely you have something, but the reason we don't state those types of things as outright truths is just primarily that bias factor that's possible

And I'm not going to ignore that of course some people may have something so obviously to the point that it's outright obvious; but that's not usually the majority of people, at all, so self-dxing isn't great advice for the majority. -And for those types of people going to a doctor's office is just a matter of putting a stamp on it, rather than "proving" they have it, so they wouldn't be asking about the validity of self-dxing in the first place because of their confidence in that... of course- some people may believe they fall into that category while not actually being that; thus why we don't give out the advice that self-dxing is reliable, I would think, because even with research one may be biased or may find the wrong resources or- you get the point.

3

5:57 PM

so in summary my points:

it isn't reliable for a majority due to bias the amount of bias one may have towards whatever they think they have varies widely from person to person- the only common point is that a lot of people tend to be biased towards certain things.
- People don't always find the same resources
One person may find a certain resource that says something someone else disagrees with in their resource- and no, not everyone is a perfect fact-checker, nor do some people even care to somehow!(thus why some people think vaccines give autism... obviously that's not most people but I digress). Thus again is another reason self-dxing may have varying results amongst similar people. .

(edited)

5:57 PM

i tried to summarize

5:57 PM

and failed

5:57 PM

oops

5:59 PM

I just tend to write in paragraphs xd

Well, I certainly get your point

:)

Fran

the best person to diagnose you... is yourself*

@sh - jump Btw. you have given a person who clearly didn't have knowledge, an advice to self-diagnose. It could be harmful.

no i didn't i remember speaking to multiple ppl recently, i think one was 'just seek advice and do research' if they do research then they have knowledge also being diagnosed could be harmful. being told to speak to a doctor could be harmful. going outside could be harmful. please use more meaningful evaluations

6:10 PM

it all depends on so much, so saying 'it's always terrible' is just wrong

I feel like what I mentioned about the researching thing could be restated there

6:48 PM

because generally the reason doctors are trusted to have the right info is because they get taught in school/informed later in their job about whatever is the official standard, or what things have changed when the official standards do change. (edited)

6:51 PM

and if you're concerned about doctors being wrong or biased, then that comes down to just finding good doctors, which is usually done by looking and reviews and such- maybe not the negative ones per say but whether a particular place as great reviews or just "okay" reviews (edited)

sh

if you understand that wiki page then you'll be fine this is my experience (edited)

You will be fine because if you understand that wiki page you wont self-diagnose. Knowing that you are biased does not remove your bias. Beeing aware of your bias will just make you avoid entering that bias altoguether, that is, not self-diagnose.

KiTTiKaTTy( •̀ .̫ •́ )✧

>read a discussion from 8 days ago >see the link someone posted in the discussion >copy and paste it again with same argumentation, people don't remember it was posted anyway

Didnt see that. I apologize.

it’s fine lol

10:03 PM

i found it funny, i will just claim your reaction emojis

KiTTiKaTTy( •̀ .̫ •́ )✧

i found it funny, i will just claim your reaction emojis

All yours!

10:06 PM

We were deepfaking nifty into stuff yesterday and got the same "wtf i didnt do that" sensation that you get when you read your headmates messages. Really interesting.

I half heartedly self diagnosed myself with OSDD (not anymore obv), and I began to have fake symptoms because it was expected and it eventually developed. I had flashbacks to trauma that wasn't mine (never had flashbacks beforehand), became very burnt out, was never myself/fronting or whatever, formed a child "alter", the list goes on (edited)

3:29 PM

Self diagnosing can be really harmful for disorders like that

3:29 PM

BUTTTT

3:30 PM

Self diagnosing....but not really for things like asd, adhd etc for when you notice a LOT of symptoms and you don't have the help and resources can be helpful for giving yourself accommodation and things that might genuinely improve your life

3:31 PM

Thats not meaning "go around telling ppl you're autistic and post it everywhere" but telling your work you have sensory issues and other things I can't think of rn

3:32 PM

I'm sure someone else could explain that better but basically, don't self diagnose unless you are really really sure of symptoms that have shown through your whole life and it will help in improving your life etc

Just visit the doctor if you think you might have something serious, before taking you having that thing as a fact.

Guys! I discovered a way fo dissociating that worked amazingly atleast for me The thing is, it may have worked well on me because i really like chess, so you gotta know about it in order to do it So the first step is to be on a comfortable position, then, you can do this with your eyes open or closed, you have to imagine you are on a chess game, it can be during the endgame, mid game or opening, it doesn't matter, now think that you are making moves and the less you focus on your surroundings, the betteŕ your moves are, and you have to make your mind believe that if your body moves or you start to loose focus, you'll make blunders, in that way, your brain, atleast for me, unconciously will make you stay more and more still, and make you focus less and less about everything that isn't your chess game. At some point when you have reached a great state of only thinking about the chess game and nothing else, feel like your brain leaves your head, letting it play more freely without havig to be attatched to your body, now you are just a brain without body playing a chess game, you don't have a body, you are only playing chess as a single brain

what a strangely specific way does make me think that personalizing however you dissociate to be more related to your own experiences and skills could prove more effective than a given generic method in some cases

Exactly

7:29 PM

maybe someone who likes another thing could make it like that

7:31 PM

but i think chess is a good thing to use as it involves a lot of focus and if you like and are basically crazy for this game your brain can naturally shut down itself

If you are actively thinking that the more you focus on your surroundings the more you will fail, that will make you focus on your surroundings. Like telling someone not to think about something, you can skip that part completely.

yeah, i think i didn't said it correctly

7:31 PM

i don't specifically tell myself to not focus on my surroundings

7:31 PM

just wanted to put it clear

7:32 PM

but it is more like an instinctive thing, to like throw your brain at a board and leave your body alone

7:34 PM

the thing is that at some point, atleast for me, you wont be telling yourself to not think about it, and your brain will just flow and be playing by it's own

In any case, if you just play chess in a computer and keep awareness of what you feel you will relize that you dissociate just the same, you just dont notice it because you are not looking for it.

7:35 PM

Try to remember a moment in which you were playing a game. Do you remember yourself in the real world moving the mouse and pressing on the keyboard while looking at a screen or do you just remember what you were doing on the game?

exactly, i was just clearing everything and how (i think) it worked

7:35 PM

because how i did it it felt pretty instinctive and not a step following thing

I believe you are just making yourself aware of something that you already do (which is interesting too). (edited)

hmmm

7:36 PM

please elaborate

7:36 PM

on that last thing

Desting 😎 (Con Cat)-(おひたし、お浸し)

In any case, if you just play chess in a computer and keep awareness of what you feel you will relize that you dissociate just the same, you just dont notice it because you are not looking for it.

Its just this. You arlready dissociate when playing chess, or any game for that matter. By doing your exercise you are just being aware of it. At least thats what i believe.

it looks like it

7:38 PM

still, it is a good method and it worked pretty well for me

7:39 PM

maybe changing it for another thing that takes someone else's focus can also work

7:39 PM

as i said before, atleast for me, this method could help because you are basically placing your focus on another thing and not on being YOU, and could help giving more space to your tulpa, or just being a dessociating tool

Lustror

Guys! I discovered a way fo dissociating that worked amazingly atleast for me The thing is, it may have worked well on me because i really like chess, so you gotta know about it in order to do it So the first step is to be on a comfortable position, then, you can do this with your eyes open or closed, you have to imagine you are on a chess game, it can be during the endgame, mid game or opening, it doesn't matter, now think that you are making moves and the less you focus on your surroundings, the betteŕ your moves are, and you have to make your mind believe that if your body moves or you start to loose focus, you'll make blunders, in that way, your brain, atleast for me, unconciously will make you stay more and more still, and make you focus less and less about everything that isn't your chess game. At some point when you have reached a great state of only thinking about the chess game and nothing else, feel like your brain leaves your head, letting it play more freely without havig to be attatched to your body, now you are just a brain without body playing a chess game, you don't have a body, you are only playing chess as a single brain

I find staring in mirrors is the best way for me, works best when weed high full body mirrors are the best for this. Other drugs like lsd will do similar but more intense think "im looking at an animal, a monkey" really stare and get a bit existential you are a part of the universe but your body is 70% water, is that you? are you the water you just drank your cells fully replace themselves every 7-10 years, every one. why are you still you. your ideas of what are you are flawed, you have been so many parts of the universe already (edited)

8:37 PM

really close staring instantly works for me (edited)

8:43 PM

not too fun to do tho

8:43 PM

bit boring, just ur brain convincing itself something is wrong am I here aah same thing as tulpas as a trauma response people dissociate to cope (edited)